May Need to Stop Endonsal – Acute Pain

I am sorry to hear this. What did your practitioner tell you about the pain, did you share with him the feeling of tenderness in advance?

@abdulrahman Yes, I did! And he was concerned, as well as confused. He told me that he had done over 200 sessions, and no one had ever expressed to him these symptoms. Pressure, yes. Ache, yes. But not acute and sharp pain. I went forward on the first inflations despite his skepticism, but then we both mutually decided to cut the endonasal session short — and then he proceeded to crack my spine into delicious oblivion.

He suggested to go to the dentist and have an evaluation before we come back to endonasal. Unfortunately, I’m in a bit of weird location for these kinds of therapies — there are a few specialists who are familiar with ALF, NCR, etc but they start out about 50 miles away.

My chiropractor, who I really respect, is not trained in NCR or ABC, only trained in endonasal under the philosophy of correcting headaches and TMJD, he’s not concerned or familiar with facial asymmetry.

Posted by: Sclera

 and then he proceeded to crack my spine into delicious oblivion.

 

haha, sounds awesome.

If he only did 200 sessions he might not know allot about the process but he might be on to something when he recommended seeing a dentist. Maybe you have something in the teeth that is causing this.

I actually think it has much more to do with the vomer bone than the teeth. When I blow my nose or push on my nose, the vomer bone aches, which then sends a pain down to the right incisor. Maybe I fractured it, maybe it’s still shifting from the first session.

I’m considering going not only to my dentist but to a nose specialist for an analysis or x-ray. But this was a money rabbit hole I never wanted to go down in the first place. I can also imagine what I’d be hearing. “Why in the world did you do this?! Stop it!” I’m hoping to find someone who really understands the intention behind endonasal release before going to a consultation.

I’m just really glad I never tried to do endonasal release by myself. Boo.

Posted by: Sclera

The roots of my teeth have grown into my sinus cavities, so it might explain the sensitivity 

Why have the roots of your teeth grown into your sinus cavities???

@Couda – yeah isn’t it freaky?? But two dentists have verified. I don’t know! I wonder if it’s related to my skull development.

Sorry you’ve had this complication @sclera! I haven’t ever felt any pain like that during my self treatments, but I also haven’t achieved anything as satisfying as the way you described your first session. Did you experience the pain while they were inserting the balloon or during the inflation? Is it possible that they just scratched the mucosa inside your nose? Do you get the same kind of pain if you stick your finger in your nostril?

@apollo – Yeah, I’m really really annoyed, as I saw forward shift of my mandible and I wanted more!

First session, I felt discomfort on both sides, but especially the left side when inserting the balloons. My  passages were REALLY tight. But the feeling was more like stuffing something into a tight space.

Second session, I felt pain, not just discomfort – again, more sharply on the left.

Did an experiment and stuck a finger up both nostrils – I still do experience the pain when my finger presses against the vomer bone from the left, and it activates then the dull pain in my front four to 6 teeth. I can still bite down hard without issue.

I think my best bet is to just give my nose a break and test again in a couple weeks.

Two months later, and I have a bit of an update. After some time, I decided not to go to the dentist/nose specialist and get x-rays. Call me foolish, but meh. I kept track of my recovery, and gave my skull some time to settle down.

I had one more partial endonasal release session a week or two ago, only going into one chamber to test things out. After my chiropractor and I both agreed that we could try going further today, I completed my first full session since my initial experience (see this thread here:  https://the-great-work.org/community/case-discussions/endonasal-technique-1st-session-complete/).

We were able to successfully inflate in all six chambers. I felt the crunches and pressure, and also the pain shooting down into my incisors, but not nearly as bad as the 2nd session that began this thread. It was bearable, and only 45 minutes later, any pain is gone.

All that’s lingering is pressure and tingling along my cheeks, nose, temples and forehead as I mew (lightly). There’s still slight pressure feeling along my incisors, but no pain.

I’m curious to see if my progress photos will show any increased symmetry to my nose, but I’ll have to wait until tonight to do that, and then take follow up photos in a couple weeks.

Does the pain result from inflating through all 6 of the meatuses or only some of them? Is it always the same meatuses which cause the pain or does this change between sessions? During my self treatments, I typically do what you described, inflating through all 6 meatuses. However, a contributor on the BTM forum called Improvement recommends alternating sides based on the cyclical turgesence of the turbinates: 

Posted by: Improvement

You should treat 1 side a day depending on your nasal cycle

For example, I always treat mine around 10am – 4pm

– Let say I inflate my right side today at 2pm because my passages were open at that time
– I will rest tomorrow
– And do another inflation to my left side on Tuesday whenever it’s open 

I choose to treat myself when my passages are open because it’s easier for the cot to go thru. it’s not necessary 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nasal_cycle

Before your next session, you could try a Buteyko method to unclog your nose. The theory is that a lack of carbon dioxide causes veins in your nose to become dilated resulting in congestion. This breath holding technique is supposed to raise the partial pressure of CO2 in your blood, triggering the turbinates to become less swollen and opening the meatuses to allow easier nasal breathing, and potentially easier endonasal inflation. 

Sarah Hornsby mentions it on her youtube channel:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXWYYe3PZKY

Here’s another example which I think is where I was introduced to the method:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LkWbPZbIYX0

Very interesting! I’ll look into the single side more.

The pain occurs during all 6 (edit: any and all 6). I think it has to do with the pressure against the vomer bone that then radiates down to the intermaxillary suture and my incisors.

The left side of my nose is very tight and in photos it’s differently shaped, and I think has more to do with the pain than vein dilation, but I’ll definitely check out the Buteyko method!

Posted by: Sclera

Very interesting! I’ll look into the single side more.

The pain occurs during all 6 (edit: any and all 6). I think it has to do with the pressure against the vomer bone that then radiates down to the intermaxillary suture and my incisors.

The left side of my nose is very tight and in photos it’s differently shaped, and I think has more to do with the pain than vein dilation, but I’ll definitely check out the Buteyko method!

Yeah, it’s interesting that you feel like the pain comes from the area of the septum in the center of the nose rather than the turbinates which project in from the sides. I suspect you might have a spot in your nose where a nerve is getting compressed, especially with the endonasal manipulation, which would elicit the type of shooting pain you describe. The anterior ethmoid nerve and a branch of the pterygopalatine/sphenopalatine ganglion both innervate the septum and both can become pinched between various anatomical structures, especially when the septum is deviated. In addition to the posterior part of the septum between the turbinates, the pterygopalatine ganglion also innervates the roof of the mouth and upper teeth. So, based on your description of pain radiating from your nasal septum to your teeth, I hypothesize that a branch of the pterygopalatine ganglion is causing your symptoms when it becomes pinched from pressure during the endonasal procedure.