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Orthotropic beginner help!  

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Jaysan
Active Member

REPOST, BECAUSE POSTED IN WRONG SECTION

I've posted a few times on here, but no luck. I completely understand that due to the sheer number of posts being submitted it's hard to keep up with them all, but here goes. 

I found out about Mewing at 18 and have been unable to make any progress since, and I am a month from turning 20. I feel as though my options are becoming increasingly limited as I get older and am looking for help again, I am a complete beginner. 

My maxilla is downswung, I have virtually no cheekbones and I have trouble keeping my tongue on the roof of my mouth despite my IMW being around 38-41 as it blocks my throat, my side profile is horrible and I have a gummy smile. 

I have searched for forms of treatment and am in need of help as I am regretting not trying much earlier and being more pro-active. I have found a few solutions but want to ask the experienced members here + have them give their 2 cents before I commit to any treatment plan. 

- I found a clinic near me that offers 'gummy smile' treatment through the use of orthodontic pins, gradually being tightened to 'absorb the jawline and teeth back into the skeletal structure. This sounds a tad frightening as I am unable to discern whether or not it is a pure CCW when the jawline is being reabsorbed or merely just pulled back into the face (i.e. upwards and backwards), which is the opposite of what I am looking for. 

- I have also found areas offering Maxillary expansion through the use of the DNA appliance and the Rapid Maxillary Expander (combined with Invisalign) to straighten the teeth afterwards. 

Which method listed or other methods would be suitable to gain the maximum amount of upswing + forward growth (minus the MSE as no one in Australia currently practices with the MSE unfortunately). 

Thank you so much! 

@admin @darkindigo @eddiemoney @futuremodel @apollo @ronaldead @varbrah

Am tagging as @admin said this would help with questions from other members on the board! Sorry for the inconvenience!

Quote
Posted : 06/12/2019 11:25 am
TGW
 TGW
TGW Admin Admin
Posted by: @jaysan

- I found a clinic near me that offers 'gummy smile' treatment through the use of orthodontic pins, gradually being tightened to 'absorb the jawline and teeth back into the skeletal structure. This sounds a tad frightening as I am unable to discern whether or not it is a pure CCW when the jawline is being reabsorbed or merely just pulled back into the face (i.e. upwards and backwards), which is the opposite of what I am looking for. 

- I have also found areas offering Maxillary expansion through the use of the DNA appliance and the Rapid Maxillary Expander (combined with Invisalign) to straighten the teeth afterwards. 

Which method listed or other methods would be suitable to gain the maximum amount of upswing + forward growth (minus the MSE as no one in Australia currently practices with the MSE unfortunately). 

Thank you so much! 

@admin @darkindigo @eddiemoney @futuremodel @apollo @ronaldead @varbrah

Am tagging as @admin said this would help with questions from other members on the board! Sorry for the inconvenience!

Hi @Jaysan

The first method should be avoided. It's resorbing bone and teeth roots - essentially diminishing the amount of bone you have to work with. That's aesthetic dentistry, not functional. But if they offer free consultations, maybe you could ask them more about it and let us know what they say -  different dentists use the same technique in different ways depending on their treatment philosophy. Ask them if this results in any rotation (and if they have scans). 

DNA Appliance is effective for providing lateral expansion, and rotation accompanies expansion. The maxilla rotates as it widens. 

Out of all techniques currently available, the best non-intrusive ones are DNA, BioBloc, ALF. While none of these actually fully resolve the issue, they're low-risk ways to make good progress. Especially as night-time appliances.

RME is more intrusive, but I think you'll get more mileage from reading the MSE threads and Ronny's website than me explaining its effects here. 

ReplyQuote
Posted : 06/12/2019 11:39 am
Jaysan
Active Member

@admin

Would intrusive imply that it would be more effective in terms of cheekbone projection and/or increase lateral expansion? Also, how does the maxilla rotate as it expands? I've been reading a lot but many people say it just droops lower 🙁

 

Thank you!

ReplyQuote
Posted : 07/12/2019 11:13 pm
TGW
 TGW
TGW Admin Admin
Posted by: @jaysan

@admin

Would intrusive imply that it would be more effective in terms of cheekbone projection and/or increase lateral expansion? Also, how does the maxilla rotate as it expands? I've been reading a lot but many people say it just droops lower 🙁

 

Thank you!

No, intrusive just means cutting or drilling into you, where appliances are superficial. 

The growth and rotation of the maxilla are the same process. As it grows, it rotates

ReplyQuote
Posted : 08/12/2019 8:47 am
Jaysan
Active Member

@admin

Thank you for the clarification. 

Can I order a biobloc from somewhere, or do I need to go to an orthotropic practitioner? Because in Melbourne, so far, they only treat children. I visited Dr Simon Wong recently in Melbourne, and all he told me was, 'your growth has finished, BioBloc wouldn't achieve anything, I can give you aligners to straighten your teeth if you wish'. Seems all ive got are RME's and the DNA's, no one practices SME either. 🙁

Thanks!

ReplyQuote
Posted : 08/12/2019 9:12 am
Jaysan
Active Member

@admin

Hello Admin! I had read over the entire MSE thread and also Ronald Ead's forums but were unable to find sufficient answers. Sorry for the continuous messages but just a few more questions from me and I'll be on my way. 

 If I were to decide to expand using the RME as many of the other options aren't available, will I:
- Still be able to mew once the expander is removed?

- Would RME expansion cause CCW rotation without lower facial height lengthening?

- Will cheekbones be improved post-expansion, or will the expansion only act as a catalyst for mewing to improve the cheekbones?

- Does CCW cause the antegonial notch of the mandible to remodel and straighten out?

 

Thank you for the clarification!

 

ReplyQuote
Posted : 17/12/2019 12:47 pm
TGW
 TGW
TGW Admin Admin
Posted by: @jaysan

@admin

Hello Admin! I had read over the entire MSE thread and also Ronald Ead's forums but were unable to find sufficient answers. Sorry for the continuous messages but just a few more questions from me and I'll be on my way. 

 If I were to decide to expand using the RME as many of the other options aren't available, will I:
- Still be able to mew once the expander is removed?

- Would RME expansion cause CCW rotation without lower facial height lengthening?

- Will cheekbones be improved post-expansion, or will the expansion only act as a catalyst for mewing to improve the cheekbones?

- Does CCW cause the antegonial notch of the mandible to remodel and straighten out?

 

Thank you for the clarification!

 

Whether or not you'll still be able to mew is up for debate. On the one hand, there's no reason why not. On the other hand, it's possible that the procedure dulls/damages the responses of the sutures and palate to pressure, or that your palate becomes wide such that your tongue can no longer really apply lateral pressure because they now match in size.

Growth and rotation happen at the same time. Rotation goes hand-in-hand with increasing facial height, it's not a bad thing

Cheekbone improvements, and any improvement of the face or rotation, with MSE is not verified. Some people have changes, but the changes aren't equivalent to the amount of expansion. 

Hypothetically, yes, the antegonial notch decreases as the whole complex rotates upwards. 

ReplyQuote
Posted : 17/12/2019 3:41 pm
Jaysan
Active Member

@admin

Thanks for clarifying! 

Sorry for all the questions bu I have just one more question! Is it safe to use a face-mask to protract whilst using the RME? Are there any negative side effects of tooth-borne expansion?

 

Thank you!

ReplyQuote
Posted : 22/12/2019 11:31 am