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For the vaulted palate homies  

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Colette
Eminent Member

Hello!

    I have been absolutely bamBOOZLED. I thought we were all working with high, narrow palates here. {Mine is like a cathedral}

Then I am reading around seeing that not everyone has a vaulted palate and that there aren't many materials or success stories yet with people who have them. WHAT! I thought we all had them, though it now makes sense that I havent made too much progress with my palate with pressing the anterior part of my tongue to the roof of my mouth.

Now, what I am hoping for here is a collection of people with vaulted palates sharing what has worked for them. I plan on using my tongue, no expander and I will not accept that it's not possible, so miss this post with all that.

We can do this, m8's.

Vaulted palates, unite! 

Quote
Posted : 16/06/2019 4:10 am
darkindigo
Reputable Member

Love your energy.  Have to reshape the palate.  That seems tricky with the tongue.  Not sure the best way?  You'd want to replicate something like Vivos or SLDA.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 16/06/2019 7:27 am
GreekGodBrody
Trusted Member

Ascend, or die trying

ReplyQuote
Posted : 16/06/2019 1:42 pm
mr.mewing
Trusted Member
Posted by: darkindigo

Love your energy.  Have to reshape the palate.  That seems tricky with the tongue.  Not sure the best way?  You'd want to replicate something like Vivos or SLDA.

tongue is steady man no worries or he has to use fixed retainers

ReplyQuote
Posted : 16/06/2019 5:19 pm
Colette
Eminent Member
Posted by: darkindigo

Love your energy.  Have to reshape the palate.  That seems tricky with the tongue.  Not sure the best way?  You'd want to replicate something like Vivos or SLDA.

Don't you think that if it's the tongue that put me in this mess, it's the tongue that can get me out? That's the belief system I'm going with for now. I feel as if I put my tongue up in the vaulted ceiling of my mouth and smash there *cylindrically I will have to carve some space out eventually. If water can shape rock, than surely my applied force and intention can shape bone. I need some inspiration though!

ReplyQuote
Posted : 17/06/2019 8:56 am
Colette
Eminent Member
Posted by: GreekGodBrody

Ascend, or die trying

Yes, I will apply so much force it will expand my skull and my pineal gland will start shining with light all the way to the heavens, and all of the pressure that I am applying upward in my maxilla will be the exact force that lifts me into another plane of existence

ReplyQuote
Posted : 17/06/2019 8:58 am
AmiMM liked
CristinaRose
Active Member

I have a vaulted palate also.  I like your description. 👍 I was born with the tightest tongue-tie ever, so it makes sense why my palate formed that way.  I'm tongue-tie free for over a year now, but have many, many years of catch-up time.  I'm getting there, though.  I have the fattest tongue ever! So somehow this must work.    I see improvements in my photos slowly (like water shaping rock). 

ReplyQuote
Posted : 17/06/2019 3:32 pm
Colette liked
Progress
Member Moderator

The defining question when it comes to palatal vault is: will the middle vault come down, or will the sides of the palate move up? To me it makes sense that a dorsal hump especially could be a sign of the middle portion of the palate having bent up- and outwards due to the constricting forces from the surrounding bones. This would then have pushed the nasal cartilage outwards, resulting in the hump.

It begs the question: if the middle-palate is already projected excessively outwards, how beneficial is it to push upwards on the palate? Perhaps it would be more beneficial to focus on performing a firm suction-seal so that the lips and cheeks are sucked in against the teeth and the jaws. While this would generate a force similar to wire-braces, the crucial difference is that in order to create a natural suction-seal in the mouth, the posterior tongue has to be lodged into the soft palate, or the vacuum won't form. This support from the tongue could allow the palatal vault to ascend down and even out without pulling the whole face down with it.

When you suck the lips and cheeks against the teeth, you can then use the mandible to modulate the intensity of the suction by pulling it away from the maxilla, so that the teeth end up slightly apart. It seems to create a strong vacuum that extends all the way down to the hyoid. This may be elementary knowledge to someone who understood the function of the lip seal from the very beginning, but to me it was a remarkable revelation. I used to think that simply keeping the lips together was a proper lip seal.

 

ReplyQuote
Posted : 17/06/2019 4:26 pm
GreekGodBrody
Trusted Member
Posted by: Colette
Posted by: GreekGodBrody

Ascend, or die trying

Yes, I will apply so much force it will expand my skull and my pineal gland will start shining with light all the way to the heavens, and all of the pressure that I am applying upward in my maxilla will be the exact force that lifts me into another plane of existence

It was more of a non-serious reply 🙂 .
I have a high-arched palate, too

ReplyQuote
Posted : 18/06/2019 3:59 am
Wellwellwell
Active Member

Great thread!

Super vaulted palate here... 4 months of mewing with zero progress in terms of IMW.

IMW is the only thing I value because it is the only clear change I can track, I am dead on 35mm since I began mewing.

Tried various forms like  getting the tip of my tongue back a little to fill the vault and the usual one where the tip is right behind the teeth.

The thing is I can actually feel forces on my nose and cheekbones when I mew, seems to be the same force described by many users here. I also sometimes feel  force on my molars.

But still like I said no change in IMW...

This post was modified 2 months ago by Wellwellwell

- Age: 30
- Started soft mewing on 12 Feb 2019
- Started closed mouth chewing on 20 Apr 2019. Chews 12 regular sugarless gums 30-60 minutes a day (on and off)
- Started chintucking once a day for 4 minutes since Apr 1st 2019
- Sleeps in bed with pillow.
- Sleeping position: side, stomach.
- does not chintuck in bed.
- Sleep with mouth taped since Apr 1st 2019 (not sure if tongue touches roof).
- Staring IMW: 35 mm
- Current IMW: 35 mm

ReplyQuote
Posted : 18/06/2019 7:09 pm
GreekGodBrody
Trusted Member

@wellwellwell Almost exactly my situation. I feel sensations in my cheekbones, nose, brow ridge and even on the top of my skull, when soft mewing.

My IMW has increased 1mm at most, in over 6 months 😥 😥 

ReplyQuote
Posted : 19/06/2019 4:53 am
Wellwellwell
Active Member

1mm is still progress 😀 

what do you think contributed the most to it?

I am considering using the ALF appliance.. Maybe it’s the help I need to get things started.

This post was modified 2 months ago by Wellwellwell

- Age: 30
- Started soft mewing on 12 Feb 2019
- Started closed mouth chewing on 20 Apr 2019. Chews 12 regular sugarless gums 30-60 minutes a day (on and off)
- Started chintucking once a day for 4 minutes since Apr 1st 2019
- Sleeps in bed with pillow.
- Sleeping position: side, stomach.
- does not chintuck in bed.
- Sleep with mouth taped since Apr 1st 2019 (not sure if tongue touches roof).
- Staring IMW: 35 mm
- Current IMW: 35 mm

ReplyQuote
Posted : 19/06/2019 5:06 am
Wellwellwell
Active Member

Here is what i have been doing so far which hasn’t helped my IMW (I have a vaulted palate):

1. Mewing -trying to keep the back of my tongue up.

2. K2 - about 2000 mcg of mk4 and 200mcg if mk7

3. Glue mouth during sleep time - I have been using a face  plaster that does not seal it perfectly though. I do wake up with my mouth slightly open sometimes. I also use a snoring app for sleep and it appears that I am silent the majority of the night.

4. Played around with face pulling but didn't really stick to it.

5. Chin tucks, trying to keep a good body posture during the day.

6. Chewing - I chew for an hour every day.

 

Doing this for about 4 months now with no visible change.

Now I am trying to be even more aware of mewing during the day and trying to stick to doing chin tucks and chewing exercises.

 

If things start moving I will update 🙂

This post was modified 2 months ago by Wellwellwell

- Age: 30
- Started soft mewing on 12 Feb 2019
- Started closed mouth chewing on 20 Apr 2019. Chews 12 regular sugarless gums 30-60 minutes a day (on and off)
- Started chintucking once a day for 4 minutes since Apr 1st 2019
- Sleeps in bed with pillow.
- Sleeping position: side, stomach.
- does not chintuck in bed.
- Sleep with mouth taped since Apr 1st 2019 (not sure if tongue touches roof).
- Staring IMW: 35 mm
- Current IMW: 35 mm

ReplyQuote
Posted : 19/06/2019 5:55 am

Fellow beings,

I suggest you consider face pulling techniques as a possible avenue to widen your palates.

In this thread a technique is given -- admittedly, the first post doesn't give it as clearly as later ones -- and IMW progress is reported: https://the-great-work.org/community/main-forum/frequent-low-tension-facepulling-a-potentially-effective-new-technique-for-adjusting-the-skull-by-hand/

As this technique may be dangerous, you will need to carefully weigh it up for yourself.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 19/06/2019 3:16 pm
Colette liked
Colette
Eminent Member
Posted by: CristinaRose

I have a vaulted palate also.  I like your description. 👍 I was born with the tightest tongue-tie ever, so it makes sense why my palate formed that way.  I'm tongue-tie free for over a year now, but have many, many years of catch-up time.  I'm getting there, though.  I have the fattest tongue ever! So somehow this must work.    I see improvements in my photos slowly (like water shaping rock). 

That's what I like to hear, CristinaRose! So what's your plan? I feel like just hot-dog smashing it up there until it hamburgers...

ReplyQuote
Posted : 20/06/2019 6:13 am
Colette
Eminent Member

Mine was not serious as well, you see 😆 @greekgodbrody

This post was modified 2 months ago by Colette
ReplyQuote
Posted : 20/06/2019 6:13 am
Colette
Eminent Member
Posted by: Progress

The defining question when it comes to palatal vault is: will the middle vault come down, or will the sides of the palate move up? To me it makes sense that a dorsal hump especially could be a sign of the middle portion of the palate having bent up- and outwards due to the constricting forces from the surrounding bones. This would then have pushed the nasal cartilage outwards, resulting in the hump.

It begs the question: if the middle-palate is already projected excessively outwards, how beneficial is it to push upwards on the palate? Perhaps it would be more beneficial to focus on performing a firm suction-seal so that the lips and cheeks are sucked in against the teeth and the jaws. While this would generate a force similar to wire-braces, the crucial difference is that in order to create a natural suction-seal in the mouth, the posterior tongue has to be lodged into the soft palate, or the vacuum won't form. This support from the tongue could allow the palatal vault to ascend down and even out without pulling the whole face down with it.

When you suck the lips and cheeks against the teeth, you can then use the mandible to modulate the intensity of the suction by pulling it away from the maxilla, so that the teeth end up slightly apart. It seems to create a strong vacuum that extends all the way down to the hyoid. This may be elementary knowledge to someone who understood the function of the lip seal from the very beginning, but to me it was a remarkable revelation. I used to think that simply keeping the lips together was a proper lip seal.

 

Progress, I'm with you about sucking the lips to form a brace over the teeth. It seems intuitive. I have wondered the same thing and feel like it would be the sides of my palate going up, because even though I have a high arch, I have a lot of visible gum showing, and the more I push my palate up, the more my nose bump is disappearing. 

Just going to work on expanding with the tongue and containing with the lips; and posture....and see where that gets me

My tongue put me into this mess and my tongue is gonna get me out of it too!

ReplyQuote
Posted : 20/06/2019 6:17 am
Colette
Eminent Member

@wellwellwell

 

Thanks for your routine!! I am curious about the gluing shut of the mouth haha. Do you breath through your nose naturally or does it get scary every once in a while when you wake up with a stuffy nose and a taped mouth?

Also, I haven't messed much with facepulling because I feel like it would be counterintuitive to what I need my face to do. 

Let's keep eachother posted on progress!!

ReplyQuote
Posted : 20/06/2019 6:25 am
Colette
Eminent Member

@transportationyuppie Thank you for the tip!

ReplyQuote
Posted : 20/06/2019 6:30 am
Wellwellwell
Active Member
Posted by: Colette

@wellwellwell

 

Thanks for your routine!! I am curious about the gluing shut of the mouth haha. Do you breath through your nose naturally or does it get scary every once in a while when you wake up with a stuffy nose and a taped mouth?

Also, I haven't messed much with facepulling because I feel like it would be counterintuitive to what I need my face to do. 

Let's keep eachother posted on progress!!

No problem 🙂

I breath through my nose during the day, but using a snoring app I found out that I sometimes snore at night.

I don’t feel much difference in my sleep when I glue my mouth, but when I check the snoring app I definitely see a difference, obviously I can’t snore with a shut mouth 😄

I haven’t woke up feeling out of breath yet, have been doing the gluing on and off for 2 months now.

- Age: 30
- Started soft mewing on 12 Feb 2019
- Started closed mouth chewing on 20 Apr 2019. Chews 12 regular sugarless gums 30-60 minutes a day (on and off)
- Started chintucking once a day for 4 minutes since Apr 1st 2019
- Sleeps in bed with pillow.
- Sleeping position: side, stomach.
- does not chintuck in bed.
- Sleep with mouth taped since Apr 1st 2019 (not sure if tongue touches roof).
- Staring IMW: 35 mm
- Current IMW: 35 mm

ReplyQuote
Posted : 22/06/2019 5:40 am
raingurl
New Member
Posted by: TransportationYuppie

Fellow beings,

I suggest you consider face pulling techniques as a possible avenue to widen your palates.

In this thread a technique is given -- admittedly, the first post doesn't give it as clearly as later ones -- and IMW progress is reported: https://the-great-work.org/community/ best pillow/frequent-low-tension-facepulling-a-potentially-effective-new-technique-for-adjusting-the-skull-by-hand/

As this technique may be dangerous, you will need to carefully weigh it up for yourself.

That's so simple and so genius. I might be overthinking but doing this for a week now it has already made me look better. Sometimes I look silly when I have to do it in public but I don't really care that much cos WORTH. Thanks for sharing, much appreciated!

 
 
 
 
This post was modified 1 month ago 4 times by raingurl
ReplyQuote
Posted : 04/07/2019 5:43 am
GreekGodBrody
Trusted Member

Wellwellwell:

- Age: 30

- Staring IMW: 35 mm
- Current IMW: 35 mm

😶 😶 

Any update in your signature? Did you start doing facepulling?

ReplyQuote
Posted : 04/07/2019 9:18 am
justdoit
Active Member
Posted by: @progress

The defining question when it comes to palatal vault is: will the middle vault come down, or will the sides of the palate move up? To me it makes sense that a dorsal hump especially could be a sign of the middle portion of the palate having bent up- and outwards due to the constricting forces from the surrounding bones. This would then have pushed the nasal cartilage outwards, resulting in the hump.

It begs the question: if the middle-palate is already projected excessively outwards, how beneficial is it to push upwards on the palate? Perhaps it would be more beneficial to focus on performing a firm suction-seal so that the lips and cheeks are sucked in against the teeth and the jaws. While this would generate a force similar to wire-braces, the crucial difference is that in order to create a natural suction-seal in the mouth, the posterior tongue has to be lodged into the soft palate, or the vacuum won't form. This support from the tongue could allow the palatal vault to ascend down and even out without pulling the whole face down with it.

When you suck the lips and cheeks against the teeth, you can then use the mandible to modulate the intensity of the suction by pulling it away from the maxilla, so that the teeth end up slightly apart. It seems to create a strong vacuum that extends all the way down to the hyoid. This may be elementary knowledge to someone who understood the function of the lip seal from the very beginning, but to me it was a remarkable revelation. I used to think that simply keeping the lips together was a proper lip seal.

 

I don't think the existence of the dorsal hump necessarily indicates that the middle part of the palate has bent up. It may be that the middle part of the palate and the dorsal hump haven't fallen as much as the sides of the palate and rest of the nose. Or it may be a little of both. Either way, I'm not sure it really matters. The suction hold may still be of utmost importance though, through complex processes beyond my comprehension, but not necessarily because 'it's too far up, so suction will bring it down'. Interesting point there about 'modulating' the intensity of the suction - just tried it, I'm amazed! This is like the hard mewing equivalent of suction hold - "hard suction!"

ReplyQuote
Posted : 30/07/2019 10:45 pm
Wellwellwell
Active Member

@greekgodbrody

0 progress so far.

I'm still at 35mm imw. I started mewing 6 months ago.

I stopped obsessing over it. I no longer do facepulling or mouth taping.

I think that some good came out of it though, my function changed, I don't find myself relaxed with my mouth open wide like before.

Sometimes I will have my lips open but my teeth are still together and tongue at the roof.

This is good because I don't look like a mouth breather in social situations anymore.

However, I do not believe that my situation can change from facepulling or hard/soft mewing alone. I don't think I had any uplift or shortening of the midface either.

So who knows, maybe mewing just doesn't work for me.

- Age: 30
- Started soft mewing on 12 Feb 2019
- Started closed mouth chewing on 20 Apr 2019. Chews 12 regular sugarless gums 30-60 minutes a day (on and off)
- Started chintucking once a day for 4 minutes since Apr 1st 2019
- Sleeps in bed with pillow.
- Sleeping position: side, stomach.
- does not chintuck in bed.
- Sleep with mouth taped since Apr 1st 2019 (not sure if tongue touches roof).
- Staring IMW: 35 mm
- Current IMW: 35 mm

ReplyQuote
Posted : 11/08/2019 8:09 am
Sailor87
Active Member

If you are able to get your tongue up in your palate where you can feel it pressing against your molars/sides of your palate, and you are still not seeing any results, that seems very strange. 

But really its a difficult thing to be sure exactly what your tongue is doing up there, there has been a few times where i was sure i had my whole tongue up only to realize later that the posterior third was not up, and was being blocked by my narrow palate. 

I then tilted my tongue and so it only pressed on one side. I managed to expand just enough to get room for the whole tongue by doing that for 2-3 months. I think I only needed 1 or 2 mm. If you do it right im sure its possible for you too, but it takes alot of dedication to get the first few mm. 

If you imw is 35 your tongue would get squuezed very hard if you got it up, and you would have no doubt that it is up there. Unless off course you have a very narrow tongue. 

I have a vaulted palate as well, and it never seemed effective for me too push up with the posterior third, as you hear so many people say. I mostly push forward/up with the middle part of my tongue. Like its curled up, and then I try to straightin it out. 

ReplyQuote
Posted : 11/08/2019 2:12 pm
Wellwellwell
Active Member

@sailor87

I think the middle part of my tongue is not touching the roof of the mouth because my palate is too vaulted.

But I will try what you suggest and try to flatten my tongue and push the middle part to create more pressure on the side of my palate.

I will report back after a month or so.

- Age: 30
- Started soft mewing on 12 Feb 2019
- Started closed mouth chewing on 20 Apr 2019. Chews 12 regular sugarless gums 30-60 minutes a day (on and off)
- Started chintucking once a day for 4 minutes since Apr 1st 2019
- Sleeps in bed with pillow.
- Sleeping position: side, stomach.
- does not chintuck in bed.
- Sleep with mouth taped since Apr 1st 2019 (not sure if tongue touches roof).
- Staring IMW: 35 mm
- Current IMW: 35 mm

ReplyQuote
Posted : 13/08/2019 11:39 am
Sailor87
Active Member

Thats why its hard to take other peoples advice, our mouths are different and its hard to know and describe exactly what the tongue is doing. But I would think if your imw is 35, you would not be in doubt if your whole tongue is in your palate, the back of your tongue would be squeezed and it would be uncomfortable. And you would also have expanded over that duration. At least I would think so, I know I did, and we are pretty much the same age. 

ReplyQuote
Posted : 13/08/2019 3:23 pm
Wellwellwell
Active Member

@sailor87

 

I think we might have similar palate shape. When I smile there is a lot of gum revealed, I think my palate is extremely vaulted. Is yours the same?

Can you try to describe in detail what you feel when you place your tongue correctly? Which area of your face feels the most pressure? do you feel more expansion pressure, forward pressure or uplift pressure?

 

- Age: 30
- Started soft mewing on 12 Feb 2019
- Started closed mouth chewing on 20 Apr 2019. Chews 12 regular sugarless gums 30-60 minutes a day (on and off)
- Started chintucking once a day for 4 minutes since Apr 1st 2019
- Sleeps in bed with pillow.
- Sleeping position: side, stomach.
- does not chintuck in bed.
- Sleep with mouth taped since Apr 1st 2019 (not sure if tongue touches roof).
- Staring IMW: 35 mm
- Current IMW: 35 mm

ReplyQuote
Posted : 14/08/2019 1:52 pm
Sailor87
Active Member

My gums dont show when i smile no, but my palate feels vaulted, but then again I dont have much to compare with. 

When I have my whole tongue up, I can feel pressure on my tongue from the molars/palate, when I do that I dont really feel any pressure in my skull. When I hard mew, I can feel the pressure in my palate after a while, in what feels like the area under the nose. Its hard for me to do both at the same time. 

The first time I got the tongue up, i used vacuum to get the front of my tongue attached to the palate, then relaxed the tongue and let the back slide gently up, while tucking my chin down. Your tongue will be narrower when its relaxed.

 

ReplyQuote
Posted : 15/08/2019 1:28 am
ancoratu
New Member

I have the same situation. I'm getting a VIVOS appliance soon to correct this problem. Three appliances total one in the upper jaw and one in the lower. Mewing with a narrow palate will cause teeth to tip and should ideally be avoided. If you have a tongue-tie you won't realize that your tongue doesn't fit your mouth until the tongue tie is released. 

ReplyQuote
Posted : 16/08/2019 5:30 am
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As you undergo correction in the near future, please consider keeping records for your own sake and for others. Pictures of dental impressions, scans, medical reports reports can be very helpful even with all personally identifying information blocked out.

Your input could help many, many people

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